Captain
Contributing Member (2009)
Fairfax, VA

# of Posts: 5

Austria: pessen Game Over / Civil Disorder
England: Dewey Game Over / Civil Disorder
France: justinim ** Game Winner **
Germany: stephen81 Game Over / Civil Disorder
Italy: Poobslag Game Over / Civil Disorder
Russia: mrc1ark ** Game Winner **
Turkey: agent44 Game Over / Civil Disorder

As I'm trying to wrie this, it's apparent to me that doing it in a chronological way is very difficult because there was so much going on everywhere on the board at the same time. So instead I will go power by power and organize my observations that way.

England: We were enemies from the start with me moving into the Channel in Spring 1901. I thought I had England on the ropes and in sights for an early elimination, but a risky play by him in fall 1902 that paid off for him big time gave him new life and actually put him in great position for a counter attack. On top of that paranoia had set in with Italy being forced to pull back to Piedmont, leading me to worry about covering Marseilles, and as such I had to cover it along with making sure I took Spain, forcing me to vacate MAO in the apparently vain hope that Italy would bounce my move from Spain to Marseilles.

At this point, England and I are going back and forth between the Channel and various other territories. The turning point was an unfortunate and very critical mis-order by England that allowed me to take Liverpool. From the on it was a very slow grind to finally whittle him down to elimination, with a bit of help from Germany. He was finally eliminated in 1909, which considering that I had been putting pressure on him from the start of the game, was pretty impressive.

Germany: We had an up and down relationship throughout the game, though it was suprising how friendly we were given that I occupied Burgundy and Ruhr for some rather uncomfortable (for him) times of the game. We ignored each other in the early game, but I started collaborating with Russia once I heard there was rumblings that he and England might start working together. That combined with Russia moving into the Baltic Sea in Fall 1901 led me to start helping Russia against him. Hilarity ensued when Russia managed to convoy an army into Kiel, which then started making a tour throught Germany, going from Kiel to Holland and actually occupied Munich for an entire year.

Towards the later stages of the game, we started to become stronger allies as Russia ended up rampaging through Scandanavia and the Austria area, but unfortunately, I had to start chipping away at his supply centers to ensure that Russia could not solo. To his credit he ended up playing very well making sure that both myself and Russia did not make too much progress for a solo and give himself at least a chance of being included in a stalemate draw, though unfortunately it did not end up working out for him as he was practically eliminated at the end when the F/R draw passed.

Italy: Up until the later stages of the game we ignored each other. He was under assault from Austria from 1901 on, and that doomed him. However, he defended himself very well and managed to keep Austria from advancing past Venice. Even with Austria occupying the Ionian Sea, Italy managed to hold the line. Once Austria was collapsing in the face of a Russian attack I decided to try and start moving against Italy to keep him from making a potential comeback, though he immediately retaliated and took Marseilles in a Spring turn. At that point he proposed that I help convoy his army from Piedmont to Rome, and in exchange he'd concede Marseilles. It was an odd proposal, but he's the type of player who follows through on these type of things so I took him up on it (and there was no real risk on my part). I do wonder however how things would have played if I kept pressing the attack at that point.

Once England was completely eliminated, the time came to attack Italy once again as Scandanavia was blocked to me and I had way too many fleets to not engage Italy. It took longer than I had wanted due to an unfortunate mis-order (later complimented by a mis-order by Italy a turn after), but Italy finally was conquered by me. In a bit of irony despite being attacked by Austria from the very beginning Italy and at one point having double the units that Italy had, he surived until the game's conclusion outlasting Austria by 2 game years.

Austria: I did not colloborate with Austria much, given that he was occupied with Italy for the most part. He did alarm most of the other powers when he ballooned to 8 supply centers at the end of 1902. Despite trying to disuade fears of him by pointing out that he only had 6 units due to the fact that he couldn't use all his builds, that was enough for Turkey and Russia to stop fighting and team up against him, which unfortunately for Austria, ensured that Russia would get all of Turkey's supply centers. Eventually his zeal in focusing on Italy while making no progress made him vulnerable to Russia, and he ended up collapsing rather quickly, with Germany getting in on the feeding frenzy to ensure that Russia did not take all the centers. He did manage to stay alive for a while by making amends with Italy to ensure that Russia did not swallow up all of the Balkans and Austria too quickly. However, when I started putting the pressure on Italy, he abandoned his position, ensuring Austria's elmination in 1912.

Personally I thought the early stab on Turkey was a mistake on Austria's part. I thought Austria would have been much better off teaming up with Turkey to attack Russia or waiting and letting Turkey and Russia fight for a while longer, stabbing one of the powers if one managed to get the upper hand. Especially considering that the stab involved getting builds that he couldn't use, the end result was everyone got worried about Austria, without much tangible benefits.

Turkey: Not much to say, we didn't talk much. He started with a very strong anti-russian opening though I did try to push him to stop fighting with Russia once it became apparent that Austria was going to take major advantage of the situation. He made the novice mistake of being overly trusting to the point of leaving himself very vulnerable to a neighbor and got viciously stabbed in 1902, leaving him no choice but to make amends with Russia, and hope that Russia would let him live to help him fight Austria. Unfortunately for him Russia decided to take advantage of this and ended up swallowing Turkey, eliminating him in 1904.

Russia: We were on friendly terms for the majority of the game. We didn't coordinate much, aside from the lovely Germany tour that was taken by the Russian army, and we did start finally attacking each other when we both started our race for a solo. As was mentioned earlier he was locked in battle with Germany and Turkey from the very beginning. It was mostly back and forth between those 2 fronts, but with Austria viciously stabbing Turkey, he steamrolled that front, and once he eliminated Austria, he could finally out-position Germany. It seemed that he was in the running for a solo once Austria collapsed but unfortunately for him he had to try and advance on 2 fronts with heavy resistance, while I had only 1 front at a time to deal with, allowing me to catch up to him in terms of supply centers. We both made some plays for a solo towards the end, but at the very end we played it safe and ensure we at the very least prevented the other from outright winning.

All in all I enjoyed the game very much, it certainly didn't have a very typical beginning and there was action going on all over the board all throughout.

Last edited by justinim on 30-Mar-2010 at 08:18 PM

Valued Member
arlington

# of Posts: 4

As the Russian player here are my observations:

Turkey:
Turkey never emailed me until fall 1902? or thereabouts. This definitely tipped me off to his hostility and was concerning for me. However at the time I was being assured by Austria that he would help me out with Turkey.

This led to my opening move which I believe had significant ramifications (obviously) on the rest of the game. Italy had been pushing hard for me to open to Galacia which along with an anti austrian opening on his part would be quite bad for Austria. However I didn't feel like I could make an enemy of Austria and Turkey so I didn't move to Galacia which left Italy in an odd spot after spring 01 and he retreated in fall 02 although austria didn't move to defend against Italy. My decision to work with austria led me to send my Moscow army north to StP. I think this led both Germany and England to be more wary of me as they were nervous of me expanding into Scandinavia.

Germany was generally honest with me through out the course of the game starting with stating his intention to not let my fleet into Sweden but instead would be bouncing me and hoping to claim denmark at the end of the first year. Instead I moved my fleet into the Baltic Sea. This cemented our relationship early on as we were never able to fully cooperate until the very end of the game when Germany was attempting to balance France and myself. It also led to my higlight of the game when a few turns later I realized that an army I had in Sweden was going to be booted out regardless of what I did. Therefore I guessed correctly about which territory would be open and successfully convoyed into Kiel. This led to a several turn romp through Germany with French support of my lone army wandering around to whatever supply center was available. It was quite entertaining for me.

England and I tried to work together but he was to interested in trying to obtain Germany's support against France and so ended up working against me instead cooperating with Germany against me in Scandinavia and eventually even pushing into StP. I wasn't pleased with this but he choose not to press further while dealing with France. Englands mis order was also to my gain as he had to disband one of his units on my front. This allowed me to regain control of StP and eventually push back into Scandinavia.

Down south my fate was largely decided by Austria's choice to side with me instead of Turkey. I think this was up in the air the first few turns and if I had been unable to defend Sevastopol from Turkey I believe that he would have turned against me. It was quite the trick to keep Sevastopol in those early turns. Austria could have caused my early downfall here by ordering Budapest to Rumania in Fall 01. This would have allowed Turkey into the Black sea and prevented me from achieving a second fleet in Sevastopol that was key to its defense.

However once Austria turned on Turkey it was a quick fall down hastened by a auto disband after not entering retreats correctly. Turkey offered to work together against Austria which was tempting but I had already seen how hard it is to eliminate Turkey and wanted to take the opportunity while present instead of allowing him to regrow his strength.

This also left me in position where most of my forces were near Turkey / Balkans and Austria's units were much more positioned in / near Italy. This left much of Austria's rear flank open to me and after rejecting numerous pleas to stab Austria earlier I finally did attack. Italy worked with me briefly on this campaign but then to my dismay quickly abandoned his portion of the fight to go attack France. This left me with a much more dragging campaign than I had hoped. This combined with an unanticipated retreat by an Austrian fleet to Eastern Med led to Austria staying alive far longer than I hoped.

Also once Italy was rebuffed by France he returned to assist Austria in containing me. This and Germany's sole focus on me led to several turns of extremely slow growth for me while France was able to quickly mop up England and catch up to me in terms of SC's. I feel I would have been able to solo had Germany paid equal attention to France and myself or had Italy not abandoned fighting Austria so fast or returned to Austria's aid.

The end game was once France finally did turn its attention to Germany and Italy and they were force to take steps aside from containing me. This led to me finishing off Austria and slowly pushing forward against Germany. However France had already expanded to the point where I was not able to push to a solo and instead we met at the classic north south stalemate line in central Europe with both of us having / set to have 17 SC's in the last year and I did not see a way to force my way into any additional supply centers.

Valued Member
Virginia

# of Posts: 7

The defense of my moves as Austria:

Initially, I had no desire to fight with Italy and was looking forward to taking advantage of what appeared to be two countries who were going to be locked in battle for many turns (Turkey and Russia). Unfortunately, the first turn unexpected move into Tyrolia by Italy altered my plans greatly as I decided that Italy couldn't be trusted and needed to be eliminated.

I tried to play both sides in the Russia/Turkey war as long as I could before basically being forced to pick a side. I initially wanted to side with Turkey because he seemed more devoted to an alliance with me and I was also leery of the two Russian fleets in the Black Sea area. Unfortunately, Russia made some good moves and Turkey forgot to enter a retreat order. Suddenly, Turkey was looking quite vulnerable, and so I decided to side with Russia.

After pulling off the Turkish stab, though, it put me in an uncomfortable spotlight. People saw how quickly Austria was growing and it scared them. For this reason, I made the conscious decision to try to expand at a slower rate, hoping that people would forget about the Austrian threat. I made ultra-conservative moves against Italy which made progress slow to a crawl, but also ensured that there was little chance of Italy catching any of my units off-guard. Also, in order to appease Russia, I agreed to help him into Turkish supply centers at the cost of losing a few supply centers of my own. This proved to be my biggest mistake.

The rest is pretty much history. Russia took advantage of my eagerness to please and once he was done with Turkey, he came after me. My units were horribly out of position, preparing for a death blow against Italy which I never had the chance to execute. I managed to survive for a long time, thanks to Germany's assistance, but my death was assured early on.

Very disappointing game, considering the stellar opening hand that I was dealt. I don't know if I agree that I misplayed things with Turkey and Russia, as I believe my stab of Turkey was pretty devastatingly effective, but I'll definitely admit that Russia outplayed me in the mid-game. Obviously, in retrospect, I wish I had moved more quickly against Italy, but that might've just brought the wrath of France and Germany against me. It was a fun game, though, even if it didn't end up well for me.

Valued Member
arlington

# of Posts: 4

Hmm in the begining I never told Aaron I would or wouldn't move to Galacia. I wonder if I had told him for sure that I wouldn't if would have made a different opening move and how much that would have altered the rest of the game. No Italian opening move to scare Austria less Austrian units out of position. Perhaps a very different game.

Valued Member
arlington

# of Posts: 4

Its interesting to me looking back over the game and looking at the moves each turn to see where things could have changed in a big way. What if certain times people guessed one way and how big an effect it would have had if they had guessed different.

My convoy to Kiel being one. If that had been blocked Germany wouldn't have had to deal with that.

If Italy had taken Greece from Austria in like 1908 or somewhere in there. He would have kept 4 units instead of going down to 3. Would that have let him hold off France longer? Would I have taken Greece anyway and come after Italy instead of Miguel?

If England hadn't mis ordered and kept Miguel out of Liverpool. Would have continued his push into Russia? Would a solid England been able to convince Germany to work against France?

What if Austria had cooperated to take out Russia with Turkey? Would Turkey have developed Independence or would have largely followed Austria's orders for most of the game?

Interesting thoughts.

Valued Member
Arlington, VA

# of Posts: 3

I can answer one of your questions, Daniel. If England had kept France out of Liverpool, I would have been a better ally and not stabbed him. When Liverpool fell, and feeling pinched by Russia, I became convinced that an Anglo-German alliance against France wasn't going to do me a lot of good, and that I needed to ditch my dying ally. Unfortunately, I had to speed up England's demise in the process.

In retrospect, I'm not sure it was the best decision, but by that point I didn't think that England and I had much of a plan for taking on France.

Captain
Contributing Member (2009)
Fairfax, VA

# of Posts: 5

quote:

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Unfortunately, the first turn unexpected move into Tyrolia by Italy altered my plans greatly as I decided that Italy couldn't be trusted and needed to be eliminated.

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Valued Member
arlington

# of Posts: 4

I think he was hoping I would open to Galacia and work with him against Austria. However after I didn't (because I wanted Austria's help against my silent enemy Turkey) he apparently bailed on his attack. I'm not sure about that part, maybe he didn't want to go it alone against Austria but in hindsight retreating didn't garner him much good will.

Major
Valued Member
Virginia, USA

# of Posts: 8

quote:

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Originally posted by justinim
Oh right, I had completely forgotten about Italy's opening to Tyrolia, and his puzzling retreat back into Venice in the Fall. I still didn't quite get what was going on there.

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I (Italy) opened Tyrolia, planning to bother Austria/Germany and see what SCs I could get in the Fall, knowing they wouldn't cover all three. But after my opening, Germany talked about withdrawing to Munich and I realized this would put France in a very strong position, and that France would probably expand in my direction. To try and counter this, I stupidly played a very "open" Fall 1901, openly arranging a bounce in Venice with Austria, so that Germany could contest possession of the "low countries" and stop France from growing so rapidly.

Germany and Austria both went back on their word, which made my Fall 1901 orders look very silly. Austria's orders made total sense, but I was confused why Germany would choose this opportunity to lie to me, since I was bending over backwards to avoid being a threat. But it worked out OK for him in the end; France grew very big as I expected, while Germany and I got to share last place with the rest of you losers :d

Also for what it's worth I predicted the outcome of this game starting in 1902. It came out pretty close.

1903 Germany/Russia skirmish, but no clear winner. Scandinavia/East Germany turns white, Stp turns black. Austria turns on Turkey, taking Bul.
1904 France lands an army in England, Turkey drops to 2 units.
1905 Austria takes Rum. France lands a unit in Wales.
1906 Turkey eliminated, (possibly preceding a series of NMRs ) Russia turns on England, Italy/England drop to 2 units
1907 Italy eliminated, Russian/French alliance becomes obvious.
1908 England eliminated. Germany drops to 2 units.
1909 Paul establishes deadlock around Tys. Skirmish until 1910, then 3-way draw: France, Russia, Austria. Germany's probably still around.

I predicted Austria turning on Russia, rather than trying to push into Rome/Naples (with armies, no less!!) I think he should have had a part in the final draw, as he played a very strong opening. He just needs to choose his opponents better next time